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Cartagia the Mad- by tiamatschild

B5 has eaten my brain.

I've just spent the last four hours chatting with spoonishly as she watched the first several episodes of the third season. In said chat, we squealed about G'Kar's glorious coat, the Tiki Gods of Doom, how much Andreas Katsulas and Peter Jurasik rock as actors, G'Kar's singing, darkly comic scenes in elevators, how much we love Vir, and other assorted topics. And all the while, I kept begging her to make it all the way to Dust to Dust tonight. Unfortunately, sleep won out. Watch me wallow in disappointment now.
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What a Cartagia icon! And hey, I know what you mean. When Andraste watched the first six of season 4 and the last three before and including Fall of Centauri Prime in season 5 respectively, I sat glued on my computer, so much fun was it following her progress.
The Cartagia icon was graciously loaned to me by tiamatschild. I decided it was necessary to have at least one. *g*

As for the rest, well. She's promised me that she will watch Dust to Dust tonight when she comes in from her work shift, and I shall chat with her on AIM again. I also demanded that she not watch Interludes and Examinations or And the Rock Cried Out, No Hiding Place without me. *g* Thinking of it now, I should probably extract a similar promise for the first six episodes of season four. I predict, based on her reactions so far (which have consisted of a great deal of whimpering and squeeing over our favorite middle-aged aliens), that, like andrastewhite, once she starts on season four, she won't be able to stop until Into the Fire. *g*
You have such lovely icons, and now Cartagia! It makes me want to say "Awww, who's a little evilinsaneterrifyingsquicky emperor then?"
B5 icons are taking. over. my. LJ. Too many Centauri icons, Hobs go boom! But yes, isn't Cartagia adorable in an OMGSOINSANE sort of way? *chucks Cartagia's chin*

Okay, playing the interrogator is making me twisted. *g*
Squee! I will so be there!
G'Kar's singing. Ohhhh, yes. *gigglesnort*

Of course, the whole reason grey_bard turned me onto the series was Ivanova and Talia.
The folks on my flist are convinced that G'Kar is a Gilbert and Sullivan fanboy. He sings to his food. And he filks for Londo and I am dead.

*dissolves into fangirly giggles*

Of course, the whole reason grey_bard turned me onto the series was Ivanova and Talia.

Now there's a relationship with interesting Issues. It's not one I personally ship, being obsessed with pouchy aliens with tentacles and fan hair and aliens with pouches and spots and golden vocal chords, but I certainly prefer Ivanova/Talia over Ivanova/Marcus.

Ivanova/Marcus?!?

Nooooooooooooooo!

I mean, I like him. But, she's gay. She belongs to us, dammit!

GB gave me a nice long Talia/Ivanova fic, but I'm waiting till I've seen the whole series before I read it. (No spoilers! No! Although I do already know how Talia/Ivanova turns out in canon. Sigh.)

The pairing is especially cool for me because I already liked Andrea Thompson, who played Talia. She was in one of my favorite movies, which all of you should run out and rent, A Gun, A Car, A Blonde.

Also, any excuse to put a hot blonde in black leather gloves is a Good Thing (tm).

Re: Ivanova/Marcus?!?

I mean, I like him. But, she's gay. She belongs to us, dammit!

I know! But, outside of Sheridan/Delenn, Ivanova/Marcus has been the most written pairing in all of fandom. Marcus is like a doe-eyed puppy- many people simply can't resist him. (Though somehow, I've managed, owing mostly to my incredible strangeness. *g*)

Also, any excuse to put a hot blonde in black leather gloves is a Good Thing (tm).

I tend to prefer red-heads or brunettes. *g* But yes. Have you ever seen Farscape? FS is All About the Leather. The show so does not stop at gloves. It also has a young female alien character who definitely swings both ways and isn't self conscious about it.

B5 viewing progress-wise, have you managed to get beyond Sic Transit Vir?

Re: Ivanova/Marcus?!?

But, outside of Sheridan/Delenn, Ivanova/Marcus has been the most written pairing in all of fandom.

*groan* I wish I didn't know that. Well, I'd have found out sooner or later.

No, I've never seen Farscape. I'm not really so much a leather fetishist, but, you know, black leather gloves. Ahem. Yum.

I prefer blondes, as anyone who knows me even slightly can tell you. ;-)

Yes, I'm a few eps past Sic Transit Vir. I'm mad right now though, because Netflix sent me two disks in the wrong order, so I have to wait to get the right one before I can watch.... *bites nails*

Re: Ivanova/Marcus?!?

No, I've never seen Farscape.

FS is something of an acquired taste due to it's weirdness, but I highly recommend it. It is filled with wonderful Australian talent (and the equally talented Ben Browder, the one American, who is waaay too pretty in leather pants considering he is obviously a total pop culture GEEK) and is delightfully dark and disturbed. I personally want to eat Gigi Edgley and Paul Goddard (*points to icon*) for breakfast. And both were blondes last time I saw them at recent conventions- which proves that all rules are made to be broken. Hee. *g*

I'm mad right now though, because Netflix sent me two disks in the wrong order, so I have to wait to get the right one before I can watch....

NETFLIX I SHALL KEEL YOU!

What was the last episode you saw?

Re: Ivanova/Marcus?!?

*checks* Oops, Sic Transit Vir *was* the last one. I started to watch the next disk I got, realized it was out of order, and stopped. Tell you what, I'll start reporting my B5 watching in my LJ for you, okay? ;-)

GB likes Farscape a lot, so maybe she'll drag me kicking and screaming into it after she's done B5-ing me.

Re: Ivanova/Marcus?!?

Tell you what, I'll start reporting my B5 watching in my LJ for you, okay? ;-)

Hooray!

*dances a jig*

GB likes Farscape a lot, so maybe she'll drag me kicking and screaming into it after she's done B5-ing me.

I'll help. *cracks knuckles*

*G*

Did you read my entry about "Comes The Inquisitor"?

Anyway, I should warn you, I'm not all that keen on TV shows. Even when they're good, certain things about the form irritate me. GB was only able to get me to check out B5 because it featured a cynical Jewish Lesbian. I mean, they might as well have just named her Kadorienne.

Re: *G*

Well, I look forward to the challenge of changing your mind. ;) Because I have a terrible weakness for genre TV shows, even though I am quite aware of their inherent weaknesses.

As for Comes The Inquisitor: Muah. You are quite right on all points. The last comment regarding soldiers and policemen was particularly spot on. You most definitely have a future in B5 wank. Come to Dragon*Con and see the panels I'm determined to wedge into the program. *g*

I have to admit though, that all is forgiven for me when G'Kar pulls his knife on Vir in that elevator. Love! That scene.

Re: *G*

Well, GB knows my tastes pretty well, so you'd better enlist her help. ;-)

Dragon*Con? I live just a few hours away from Atlanta, so, *maybe* I will. (I used to live there, but never got around to attending.) I don't do cons and stuff much anymore, but....

Anyway, what I *did* like a lot was in an early ep, how the former war criminal was on the brink of perfecting an immortality serum, only it turned out you had to kill someone to make it. That was just... perfect. I mean, in a horrific kind of way. Only, rather than pass the buck to Kosh, I wish they'd had the captain kill her himself and take the consequences on the chin. Or even invented a character a few seasons sooner just to serve that purpose.

Re: *G*

Well, GB knows my tastes pretty well, so you'd better enlist her help. ;-)

I shall look her up. ;)

I live just a few hours away from Atlanta, so, *maybe* I will.

Oh, do! It's a wonderfully wild way to spend a Labor Day weekend. And it would be a joy to have at least one rightfangirl in attendance.

Anyway, what I *did* like a lot was in an early ep, how the former war criminal was on the brink of perfecting an immortality serum, only it turned out you had to kill someone to make it.

Ah, yes. The Nazi medical research dilemma of Deathwalker, one of the many underappreciated gems of the first season. First season has its clunkers, but really, it is sorely under-rated in fandom, I think because the show was still unpolished. Remind me to write a rave about it sometime.

Only, rather than pass the buck to Kosh, I wish they'd had the captain kill her himself and take the consequences on the chin.

Oh, that's an interesting alternative. I think, though, that Kosh was chosen for the task for a very specific narrative purpose that will become clearer to you once the full motivations of the Vorlons are explained to you in early season four. First season was entitled Signs and Portents for a reason- its purpose was, among other things. to set up a lot of lovely foreshadowing. Which is one big reason why I believe you can't watch B5 without it, even though it may initially try a new viewer's patience.






Re: *G*

I've been lucky enough to miss out on a lot of the clunkers, because GB's been filtering them for me. Every season, she tells me which eps not to bother with ("Alien Menace of the Week" type things) and which I *must* watch and which have annoying bits but are necessary for canon, etc. She did this at my request, because after I saw one of the early "Alien Menace of the Week" eps there was no way I was going to sit through another. If I wanted that kind of thing, I'd watch Star Trek. (I just know I'm gonna get flamed for that....)

The Vorlons are too perilously close to sanctimonious idealized Superior Beings... wait, they're not perilously close, they *are* sanctimonious idealized Superior Beings. And they annoy me a lot. So far, anyway.

As for Dragon*Con, given some of my traumatic experiences with leftie fangirls, I've been mostly avoiding cons and things for the last couple of years, but it's possible to wear me down with a bit of persistence.

Re: *G*

If I wanted that kind of thing, I'd watch Star Trek.

Even though I'm a Trekkie from way back, I won't flame you for that. Because yeah. Although I believe DS9 managed to transcend that in many instances.

The Vorlons are too perilously close to sanctimonious idealized Superior Beings... wait, they're not perilously close, they *are* sanctimonious idealized Superior Beings.

Yes, they are. In fact... no, that would spoil you. *g*

As for Dragon*Con, given some of my traumatic experiences with leftie fangirls, I've been mostly avoiding cons and things for the last couple of years, but it's possible to wear me down with a bit of persistence.

Well, the leftie fangirls I normally hang out with know I'm Republican and have yet to turn me out into the netherlands. So perhaps we can share a positive experience with you for a change.



Re: *G*

Even though I'm a Trekkie from way back,

Oops. *G* Hey, I liked the shows, especially when Dr. Crusher was involved, but a lot of it *was* Alien Menace of the Week. Which is fine for a while, but eventually....

And no spoilers! No! GB has been very careful not to spoil it, so don't mess up her hard work! Anyway, it's almost March, and as of March 1 I'm upgrading my Netflix subscription to let me have more movies at a time. Because I wanna watch the rest of B5, dammit.

Well, the leftie fangirls I normally hang out with know I'm Republican and have yet to turn me out into the netherlands. So perhaps we can share a positive experience with you for a change.

That would be great. Because my leftie fan friends turned on me so nastily that I almost left fandom. If I didn't love Eroica so much, if I weren't so incurably addicted to it, I would have. But therightfangirl is making it possible for me to take part again, at last!

Re: *G*

therightfangirl rocks like a rocking thing. One day, I will actually post in TRF the essay I've been writing in my head all along discussing how a Republican like me sees B5.

And cross my heart, I will be extra careful about spoilers. I love watching new viewers piece it all together. Hence my squealing over the chats with spoonishly. *g*

Re: *G*

One day, I will actually post in TRF the essay I've been writing in my head all along discussing how a Republican like me sees B5.

Squee! I can hardly wait for that!

Also, I'm gonna have to read your fic -- but not till after I've watched the series. Unless you've written in some other fandom?

We (Republicans) do tend to interpret our fandoms differently, I think. Er, based on the very small sample group I've seen. My own interpretation of Eroica differed a lot from most of what had been written when I showed up. However, since I'm prolific and it's a small fandom, my own interpretation has since infected the rest. *EG*

Re: *G*

Also, I'm gonna have to read your fic -- but not till after I've watched the series.

*is scared*

My one claim to fame is that I write an interpretation of Vir that a lot of people here seem to like. Oh- and that I run the Narn/Centauri fic archive. But I am a pale amateur compared to the likes of selenak, who is justifiably famous for her portrayal of Londo Mollari and is, I'm convinced, secretly Centauri; andrastewhite, who is generally known for her alien porn, but actually writes beautiful gen as well; leyenn, who, if you ship Ivanova/Talia, is someone you should get to know right now; deborah_judge, who is secretly Minbari; kakodaimon, who has a delightfully odd sense of humor; and many others. Read them first before you read me.

My mental Republican B5 Fan essay started months ago when one of my left wing friends challenged me to explain myself with some pretty loaded questions. I've just never had a chance to write it down.

Re: *G*

I'll read them, but I told you, I'm waiting till I've watched the whole series. Otherwise even inadvertant spoilers could happen.

Maybe you could post your essay at the Fanfic Symposium when it's finished. I have a couple of essays there, and I've long been planning one on my personal approach to slash, which is not unique but not the most common either -- that is, I prefer for it to be about the characters being gay and dealing with whatever issues that raises for them, rather than "I'm Not Gay, I Just Love This Guy" (or as one K/S slasher put it, "I'm not gay, I just like to suck Spock's cock"). INGIJLTG isn't objectionable to me, not if it's a good story, but after what I, a traditionally religious Republican, went through trying to deal with realizing I was gay, that's kind of hard to identify with. Which is why Eroica is my main fandom; one of the two heroes is obviously gay but fighting desperately to stay in the closet, possibly even from himself.

Re: *G*

I'll read them, but I told you, I'm waiting till I've watched the whole series.

I know. I'm just putting the names out there ahead of time. ;)

Maybe you could post your essay at the Fanfic Symposium when it's finished.

Whoa! That's the perfect site for me. I am such a meta junkie. I actually write meta more than I write fic, I think.

I prefer for it to be about the characters being gay and dealing with whatever issues that raises for them, rather than "I'm Not Gay, I Just Love This Guy"

Depending on the boundaries of the universe in question, though, that may not be appropriate. Some canons have no limitations on homosexuality, in which case manufacturing Issues may be straining credibility.

Then again, hmm. One of my major pairings is an INGIJLTG in a futuristic universe in which homosexuality is treated rather matter-of-factly, but it still manages to have Issues, not because of the gay, but because the relationship is interspecies and scandalous in other ways. So, while it's not the homosexuality that's at issue, both characters would still rather deny the attraction on other deeply held principles. Might that approach the parameters?



Re: *G*

So, while it's not the homosexuality that's at issue, both characters would still rather deny the attraction on other deeply held principles. Might that approach the parameters?

Oh, absolutely. And I certainly don't read "gay-issue" slash exclusively, it's just my favorite kind. Plus, what you were saying about fictional universes -- I enjoy INGIJLTG a lot more when it's set in one where it makes sense. As I put it in one of my Symposium essays: "I'd like to think that by the time the Starship Enterprise is launched, no one will care if Counselor Troi is running around with Dr. Crusher. And perhaps no one would lift an eyebrow in a galaxy far, far away if Han Solo and Luke Skywalker got close, close together. And if you're five hundred years old, maybe you've been around enough that you won't bother to ask, 'Does Methos like men?' and will cut straight to 'Does Methos like me?' On the other hand, late 20th-century policemen do not cheerfully leap into bed with their male partners without a qualm. It's hard for me to maintain my suspension of disbelief with such stories."

But it's true, if there's no Issues keeping the couple apart, it's just not as interesting to me. Guess that says something about my life experience, eh? ;-)

Re: *G*

But it's true, if there's no Issues keeping the couple apart, it's just not as interesting to me. Guess that says something about my life experience, eh? ;-)

And mine too, because I'm exactly the same way. *g* In fact, my brother was just stomping around in his dorm room yesterday over the fact that all my ships are dysfunctional in some way. "Why can't you like a normal couple for once!" I believe were his words over AIM. *g*

Re: *G*

I sympathize!